The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

[toasty]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

^^I'm going to gamble that you didn't bother to read the article accompanying the photo, right?

[toasty]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

And do you have evidence that something other than a 757 hit the pentagon? Evidence, not speculation or conjecture. And if so, what became of the people on flight 77? Are they in the witness protection program or something?

[floridaorange]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

It's the US's department of defense building, who knows, something could have blown up the plane seconds before it hit the building in which case tapes and photos certainly would not be released...blowing up or shooting down a commercial airliner would certainly raise controversy and conspiracies...this is just a thought, frankly I have no idea why there are not better photos or videos.


Anyway, Steve Riskus who apparently saw the plane crash and took the following photos leaves his email address and AOL IM name if you want to have a chat with him...

good photos:

http://criticalthrash.com/terror/crashthumbnails.html

[chunky]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

^^I'm going to gamble that you didn't bother to read the article accompanying the photo, right?

It says at the beginning of "Star Wars Along Time A Go In A Galaxy Far Away" People can write whatever they like it doesnt mean its true. Like I said before has the US Government released any Photographs of a plane colliding with The Pentagon. Now If you can show me some of them pictures or some of the video footage then I will be impressed. There's enough members of the public who have asked. There should be enough footage to see. It is the Pentagon after all. Do you think its acceptable that they haven't produced them in the public domain?

[chunky]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

And do you have evidence that something other than a 757 hit the pentagon? Evidence, not speculation or conjecture. And if so, what became of the people on flight 77? Are they in the witness protection program or something?

`

Most of the interviews and footage from Eye Witness's has been very mixed. Some people say they saw a low flying plane, some say it was small plane others say it was a large plane. Others have even said it was a missile. Like I said before I've still not seen no footage.

It's the US's department of defense building, who knows, something could have blown up the plane seconds before it hit the building in which case tapes and photos certainly would not be released...blowing up or shooting down a commercial airliner would certainly raise controversy and conspiracies...this is just a thought, frankly I have no idea why there are not better photos or videos.

There was also government official who claimed he was with Dick Cheney who claimed Cheney was given the opportunity to shoot down the supposed plane, but Cheney refused to give the order. Which just adds more confusion to the story.

[toasty]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

It says at the beginning of "Star Wars Along Time A Go In A Galaxy Far Away" People can write whatever they like it doesnt mean its true. Like I said before has the US Government released any Photographs of a plane colliding with The Pentagon. Now If you can show me some of them pictures or some of the video footage then I will be impressed. There's enough members of the public who have asked. There should be enough footage to see. It is the Pentagon after all. Do you think its acceptable that they haven't produced them in the public domain?

First of all, snopes.com is a non-partisan, non-biased site devoted to checking the veracity of urban myths, conspiracy theories, etc. Not sure why you'd take these conspiracy theorists who make no effort to be objective as gospel whilst ignoring the folks that look at it with no agenda in mind, but it is what it is. It does give me an idea of where you're coming from, though, so thanks for that.

I suspect there's not more footage of a plane crashing into the Pentagon for the same reason there's not more footage of the first plane hitting the WTC -- no one suspected there was a reason to train a camera on the Pentagon and wait. As a matter of fact, part of me suspects that if you were to just stand outside the Pentagon with a video camera rolling, you might have some guys in cammo asking you a few questions.

With that said, though, I do recall that there was some footage from a security camera that was released a while back that, while grainy and choppy, did show a plane hitting the building. I'd make an effort to find it, but I frankly have other shit to do.

[ddr]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

There is a part of me that thinks that the whole 9/11 ordeal was orchestrated by Bush and his oil cronies in order to artificially inflate the prices of oil by being in Iraq.

I find it interesting that Bin Laden, the apparent mastermind of the whole 9/11 thing, was suddenly cast off the radar after it happened. It was obvious that it was him and not Iraq but they went in there instead.

Did anyone watch that 60 minutes interview with that ranger earlier this year? They were within a football field of Bin Laden but mysteriously the order to kill him was called off. Why was the order called off?

[chunky]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

I suspect there's not more footage of a plane crashing into the Pentagon for the same reason there's not more footage of the first plane hitting the WTC -- no one suspected there was a reason to train a camera on the Pentagon and wait. As a matter of fact, part of me suspects that if you were to just stand outside the Pentagon with a video camera rolling, you might have some guys in cammo asking you a few questions.

With that said, though, I do recall that there was some footage from a security camera that was released a while back that, while grainy and choppy, did show a plane hitting the building. I'd make an effort to find it, but I frankly have other shit to do.

Yeah there where 4 stills released by the US Government none of which had a plane in them they showed and explosion and some smoke that was it. They are posted somewhere in here.

The pentagon is loaded with CCTV litteraly 100's of camera's. Thats the footage I and many others would like to see. Or are you going to tell me now that the Pentagon dosnt have CCTV.

Heres one of them



Here's another with a supposed plane. Can anyone see a plane there?

[toasty]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

There is a part of me that thinks that the whole 9/11 ordeal was orchestrated by Bush and his oil cronies in order to artificially inflate the prices of oil by being in Iraq.

I find it interesting that Bin Laden, the apparent mastermind of the whole 9/11 thing, was suddenly cast off the radar after it happened. It was obvious that it was him and not Iraq but they went in there instead.

Did anyone watch that 60 minutes interview with that ranger earlier this year? They were within a football field of Bin Laden but mysteriously the order to kill him was called off. Why was the order called off?

much more reasonable points about why we did what in the wake of 9/11, but that's a completely different question than whether or not a plane hit the Pentagon. People are even free to believe that the US Government was behind 9/11, but the "did a plane hit the Pentagon" thing it just absurd. That ship has sailed. If it was a missile, or a bomb, there are plenty of stories that could have been told that would be entirely consistent with those things happening that would accomplish the same ends.

Put another way, why bother to pretend a plane hit it if the damage was caused by something else? It's ludicrous.

[toasty]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

The pentagon is loaded with CCTV litteraly 100's of camera's. Thats the footage I and many others would like to see. Or are you going to tell me now that the Pentagon dosnt have CCTV.

You know, that's a fair point. Maybe they haven't shown that footage for the same reason they stopped showing the planes hitting the towers over and over again -- it's upsetting to watch and it really doesn't add anything unless you have some sort of bloodlust. They may have 100's of cameras, but probably only a handful that would be pointed in that general direction because, you know, why bother to point 100 cameras at the same thing -- maybe none of them got a good shot, and maybe that footage we saw was the best they had. Security cameras aren't exactly designed for catching objects moving at that kind of speed. I don't know.

It's all really a moot point, though, unless you can answer the two questions I've raised in here:

1. What happened to the people on Flight 77?
2. If it was something other than an airplane, what is gained by saying it was an airplane?

[chunky]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

You know, that's a fair point. Maybe they haven't shown that footage for the same reason they stopped showing the planes hitting the towers over and over again -- it's upsetting to watch and it really doesn't add anything unless you have some sort of bloodlust. They may have 100's of cameras, but probably only a handful that would be pointed in that general direction because, you know, why bother to point 100 cameras at the same thing -- maybe none of them got a good shot, and maybe that footage we saw was the best they had. Security cameras aren't exactly designed for catching objects moving at that kind of speed. I don't know.

It's all really a moot point, though, unless you can answer the two questions I've raised in here:

1. What happened to the people on Flight 77?
2. If it was something other than an airplane, what is gained by saying it was an airplane?

You can watch the planes hitting the towers over and over again. you cant see the pentagon one once. It mite be upsetting to watch but it adds a lot to whether the story is genuine or not. I'm also sure the pentagon, one of the most defended air spaces in the world has more than one camera pointing at one specific area.

What happened to Flight 77 has also been heavily debated. It could of been easily put somewhere else.

Its easier to say 4 planes got Hi Jacked and crashed than 2 plus an explosion at the Pentagon and a crash in Pennsylvania.

[floridaorange]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

^Chunky exactly. A detailed photo of a commercial plane that has been retargeted to crash into the pentagon is going to be classified. It's not going to be available for the publics eyes to sit back and watch in slow motion. That does not mean it doesn't exist (moot point) and that doesn't mean our government was behind 9/11. As far as oil goes there are other threads covering this topic.


*edited does NOT mean our government is behind 9/11

[toasty]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

You can watch the planes hitting the towers over and over again.

With all due respect, no shit. There were cameras all over the place by the time the second tower was hit. Go digging for footage of the first tower being hit, though, when people didn't have a reason to be watching, and it's a lot harder to find. It's out there, but most of the time when you see a plane flying into the towers, it's the second plane.

What happened to Flight 77 has also been heavily debated. It could of been easily put somewhere else.

OK, but you're still glossing over the "why" part. Why take a perfectly good plane and hide it somewhere, and then fake a plane crash into the pentagon. Why not just fly the plane into the pentagon and avoid the need to fake anything? No shortage of people died on 9/11, so saving one plane full of people would seem like a completely hollow gesture.

I think it is beyond dispute that Flight 77 was a real flight and actually took off, so what could possibly be gained from flying it somewhere else, hiding it, and pretending that it hit the Pentagon as opposed to just flying it into the Pentagon? It just makes no sense.

Its easier to say 4 planes got Hi Jacked and crashed than 2 plus an explosion at the Pentagon and a crash in Pennsylvania.

How is that easier? What difference does it make? Think back to 9/11 -- in the opening hours of the day, there were reports of car bombs going off in DC and all kinds of other shit that we now know to be inaccurate, but it seemed completely reasonable at the time. If someone launched a missile or managed to bomb the pentagon that day, would we have believed that terrorists had gotten their hands on a missile or figured out a way to bomb the pentagon? Of course we would.

[toasty]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

To be clear, if you want to argue about whether 9/11 was an inside job, whether there are unusual things about the way the buildings fell, whether there are things that we don't know about what really happened and how much we knew before it happened, that's a discussion we can have. This whole "it wasn't a plane" thing, though, is just silly. Ask the families of the people that were killed in the Pentagon whether they care if it was a 757, an ICBM, or a garbage bag full of TNT that caused that gaping hole. It just doesn't matter.

[Miroslav]

Re: The Obama Deception (New Documentary)

So was the list of names of Obama's cabinet made up them. Or are they not from Wall Street?

Sure they are. Why wouldn't they be? There's nothing secret about that; it's plain as day for all to see.

`

No Aircraft flying into the Pentagon in them photos. Is that the best you could come up with.

ah...I love a good conspiracy argument - there is just never any amount of evidence that can discredit the conspiracy. Anything that counters the conspiracy argument is obviously "part of the conspiracy!"

I guess these eyewitness accounts are also just "part of the conspiracy."

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/911_pentagon_eyewitnesses.html