The Devil

[DragonFire]

Re: The Devil

I believe in God and i believe there is a devil , but it more an evil spirit so limited in power that it's so easy to be beaten by will . I categorize some humans as devils

[kris_athws]

Re: The Devil

tell me something that people see everyday.......kings see often.....but god and devil never?

[darkabeatz]

Re: The Devil

The star of Bethlehem is most likely a fabrication, consistent with legends of the ancient world that had heavenly events portend the births of great men. In first century Palestine there was no concept of astronomy and natural law as we know it. In reality, as anyone who looks up in the nighttime sky can verify, no star high in the heavens can shine only on a particular town, let alone on a specific house as the Bible claims (Matt. 2:9-11). The Christmas star, rising in the east, moving west to Jerusalem, and then taking a little jog south to Bethlehem and finally remaining stationary, would have defied the laws of celestial motion.

Its a nice story though.........

[cowardly dj]

Re: The Devil

The star of Bethlehem is most likely a fabrication, consistent with legends of the ancient world that had heavenly events portend the births of great men. In first century Palestine there was no concept of astronomy and natural law as we know it. In reality, as anyone who looks up in the nighttime sky can verify, no star high in the heavens can shine only on a particular town, let alone on a specific house as the Bible claims (Matt. 2:9-11). The Christmas star, rising in the east, moving west to Jerusalem, and then taking a little jog south to Bethlehem and finally remaining stationary, would have defied the laws of celestial motion.

Its a nice story though.........

silly you.......you are tryng to put human limits on Godly events. If God wants a star to shine on a single piece of your hair on your head he could. God did it to show them the locatoin of Jesus.

And for the record there are no Biblical references to when Jesus was born so Christmas is not the time of Jesus birth and should not be confused as a religious holiday. Christmas did not start in religion.

[Bryanw24]

Re: The Devil

The odds are shitty id'e rather just go for the 50/50 and live my life as i choose

Thats what im thinking.

[evangelion]

Re: The Devil

If God wants a star to shine on a single piece of your hair on your head he could.

What kills me, is you really believe that. God can do anything and everything. He can shine a star on my head (which me, you, or anyone else has NEVER seen), but he can't cure AIDS, stop war or end poverty. Seems like a good use of his powers.

You know what really bothers me the most about all of your recent "teachings" CDJ?? It is a prime example of the hypocrisy that most religious people show in one way or another. Wasn't your "King Shit" story about trying to fuck some chick?? Now I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you were not married to this girl. And I'm also going to guess that being as "enlightened" as you are in god's holy ways that sex outside of marriage is a sin. A sin that someone so devoutly Christian would never willingly commit. So tell me, devoute Christian and spreader of the "good news"...how does that work??

This should be good

[Kamal]

Re: The Devil

wow this thread sure went all over the place.... and in some really absurd ways at that......

First and foremost, ask which side of you, you are questioning the most important issue here i.e. "is there a God ?"

My religious side convinces me of it based on teachings and beliefs but my scientific side toys with the idea. Isnt is very very likely that a higher intelligence thats been alive in the universe a cool 7 billion years longer than us has developed some remarkably "nifty" scientific abilities i.e. changing weathers, moving mountains, resurrecting the dead, expanding the number of liveable, viewable and interactable dimensions, teleportation, time travel etc. etc. and that we're probably some obscure experiment in a petre dish with whom they're controlling everything there is to control ?

Ok that was a bit overthrown but honestly, in all likelyhood, there probably isnt a "God" especially in the image we've portayed in this thread. There is a higher power, but thats just what it is, a power, he is not bearded in white robe hanging on a cross or sitting in Gold laden clothing and jewellry adorned by the Hindu Gods. Heaven and hell are possibly corners of the universe that the quantum of positive and negative energy reside without actually touching and negating each other out. The residual forces from a dying body be it positive or negative will most likely be drawn to those corners of the universe, consequently, you have a distorted image of heaven and hell. Seriously, there are so many things when we look through a telescope that we realize could quite well be the reality behind the distorted perception of religious books... case and point.... Dark Matter.

Thanks to Jenks, I saw "What the bleep do we know" and the woman raised an unrealistically excellent point in regards to God. If God, seriously as technologically advanced as he is, taking into consideration the complexity of the universe and the immaculate balance in which everything in the cosmos is, looking at his achievements on our very own earth with the specatucalar precision in which mother nature does everything that the does, the incredible phenomenon of Gaia and so many other countless items too complex to list in this post, if this God at the end of the day, sits in his chair to judge if you go to heaven or hell, has in fact wasted an incredible amount of his ultimate super powers in making a decision so poor when in fact the results of your actions (i.e. Karma) could have easily punished you on earth for what you have done.

God could well be a power, a form of "balancing" energy around us consequently affecting and balancing all that interacts with it. We as forms of energy are not excluded.

If God wants a star to shine on a single piece of your hair on your head he could.

CDJ there is no way that God will come to earth in a shining light and a flowing robe and drop a star on your strand of hair unless his last name was copperfield. I do believe in God, I dont believe he will do that. There has never been any instance so remotely similar to say it can be done. Making a blind woman see or a crippled walk is one thing, but to think that the fine balance of the cosmos can be toyed to that extent even by God is incomprehensible.

And this is probably the very reason that the learned / priests in most religions found it so much easier to tell the masses "its an act of God" simply because it way past their level of understanding as well

[Yao]

Re: The Devil

A nice movie to watch in this respect is "The Discovery of Heaven", after a famous book by a Dutch writer. Tells about the workings of heaven to create a human that can bring back the tables with the 10 commandments.

The book is undefeated, but they say the film is pretty well done in fact. So check it out. One of the main parts is played by Stephen Fry, if anyone here knows him. Brilliant actor.

[neoee]

Re: The Devil

I still haven't seen what the bleep.., been recommended to me multiple times. Great post E, gave me some more material to add to my views.

If God wants a star to shine on a single piece of your hair on your head he could.

CDJ, I think the following quote sum's it up:

"God does not play dice with the universe." -- Albert Einstein

What I think Einstein meant by that statement is that even God follows the rules he's created (physics).

[dek0021]

Re: The Devil

i see my reply went over well in this thread...you all entertain the believer idea....

[cowardly dj]

Re: The Devil

I still haven't seen what the bleep.., been recommended to me multiple times. Great post E, gave me some more material to add to my views.



CDJ, I think the following quote sum's it up:

"God does not play dice with the universe." -- Albert Einstein

What I think Einstein meant by that statement is that even God follows the rules he's created (physics).

That makes sense to you neoee because it is the truth. He does not go outside his own rules but I ask, How do you know what his rules are if you have never sought them out?

Let me put it to you like this. I have heard it asked before if God could make a rock even he can not lift, or could God make 2 mountains side-by-side with no valley between. The simple answer is this: All you know about your existence is what the creator has allowed you to know. Outside of that it is all speculation. Man is not infallable, science, invented by man, is not infallable. To ask if God can do someting like make a rock so big that even he can not lift it, or make a star to shine on Jesus, or shine on your head is putting man's fallable ideas of nature and its limits on the creator who made the limits. That is foolishness.

Would God go outside his own limits to prove a point? No. A true scholar of the Bible knows that God has no limits but he has limited what he will do on earth. He has told us his limitations he has placed on interaction with the earth. That does not mean that he can't, it just means that he won't.

God has not said he would stop aids, or stop suffering, or make this world a better place. What would be the joy in looking to heaven as a place of eternal rest if you had nothing to compare it to. I can name at least one phrase you and/or someone you know has said many times that echoes the concept I speak of here....No pain, No gain. If that is not a saying that was taken from the concept of suffering for the better good then I do not know what is.

[evangelion]

Re: The Devil

No response to my question, huh?? Figures...

[cowardly dj]

Re: The Devil

i see my reply went over well in this thread...you all entertain the believer idea....

you do too, you just do not know it yet.

think about this:

you have to acknowledge that fact that something has to be able to exist in order to suggest that it does not exist.

Just another infallable proof of God's existence outside of the Bible. You can not say God does not exist without entertaining the idea He might.

[Yao]

Re: The Devil

That makes sense to you neoee because it is the truth. He does not go outside his own rules but I ask, How do you know what his rules are if you have never sought them out?

Let me put it to you like this. I have heard it asked before if God could make a rock even he can not lift, or could God make 2 mountains side-by-side with no valley between. The simple answer is this: All you know about your existence is what the creator has allowed you to know. Outside of that it is all speculation. Man is not infallable, science, invented by man, is not infallable. To ask if God can do someting like make a rock so big that even he can not lift it, or make a star to shine on Jesus, or shine on your head is putting man's fallable ideas of nature and its limits on the creator who made the limits. That is foolishness.

Hmm...my athe?stic counterpart for this thought is that nature may be well beyond man's comprehension, therefore I do not try to explain my lack of knowledge by attributing it all to a higher being.

God has not said he would stop aids, or stop suffering, or make this world a better place. What would be the joy in looking to heaven as a place of eternal rest if you had nothing to compare it to. I can name at least one phrase you and/or someone you know has said many times that echoes the concept I speak of here....No pain, No gain. If that is not a saying that was taken from the concept of suffering for the better good then I do not know what is.

It was however directed at gain in this world, I'm sure

[picklemonkey]

Re: The Devil

you have to acknowledge that fact that something has to be able to exist in order to suggest that it does not exist.

:ROFLMAO:

Let's imagine a black long-hair cat with white spots around his body. he has an erect herpes-infected horse penis grafted onto his head like a unicorn, an MJ mullet growing on its head, bad electro emitting from his ass, and iPods as paws. this cat is the nicest cat that has ever walked the earth, had the best heart, and never meant any harm toward anybody. regardless, people treated him like shit. they spit on him, threw rocks at him, and eventually nailed him to a cross and burned him.

this cat isn't real, and he doesn't have to exist in order to suggest that he doesn't. I created an image of how he looked and treated others from my description... the more descriptive picture given, the better we can picture him and his personality in our head. The cat never existed, but I'm still able to suggest that without evidence or proof a creature like this never walked the earth. the same goes with God. The world has been telling detailed stories of him for centuries, and we have all painted a picture of him in our minds with details on how he looked and acted. it doesn't mean he existed... it just means we understand the concept without having to see it.



he doesn't exist, btw